“I Tried Jesus”
I’ve came across a lot of “ex-Christian” atheists on various blogs. There is no such thing. There are only two categories of people in this world: people who have been awakened to the beauty of Christ and people who haven’t. Growing up in church has yet to save anyone. Mentally acknowledging the existence of Jesus and associating with His people is the absolute best way to feel saved for a while on your way to hell. Jesus was God’s Substitute and bore the wrath for sin that the believer should have received. If that doesn’t awaken a life-long, unwavering, obsessive, and loving commitment to Christ, then an ex-Christian should take out the “Christian” part. This may shed some light on many of those who say, “I tried Jesus”:
For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt. -Heb. 6:4-6
Clint:
“Jesus was God’s Substitute and bore the wrath for sin that the believer should have received.”
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I came across this quote in one of your comments. If you have the time, perhaps you could explain to me what sort of sin an innocent newborn possesses such that God should or would punish him/her, or feel it necessary to redeem the soul of one such as this who obviously has done nothing evil during his/her life. I wonder about the morality of a divine being who would assign blame to a soul that has no capacity to understand the “fault” which he/she supposedly has been marked with, or a being who would honestly believe that such an innocent child is deserving of his wrath. Along that vein of questions, how would you react to a person who had a grievance against another and decided to exact his vengeance against the claimed offenders newborn child? For that matter, what have you or I done to merit God’s wrath besides being born of the same species of animal as those who presumably offended the beneficent creator of the universe at some time in the past? These questions represent significant obstacles to my understanding and acceptance of your notion of “original sin,” and cast considerable doubt on whether Jesus’ sacrifice benefited me at all. It is as if Jesus paid a debt not owed by either of us, to an unreasonable creditor bent on vengeance for some obligation owed by one or more of our remote ancestors. Weren’t the floods, famines,invasions, and pandemics that plagued the ancient world right up to our time and continuing, payment enough for Cain’s disobedience?
No true scotsman fallacy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_scotsman
Argument: “No Scotsman puts sugar on his porridge.”
Reply: “But my uncle Angus, who is a Scotsman, likes sugar with his porridge.”
Rebuttal: “Aye, but no true Scotsman puts sugar on his porridge.”
Replace ’scotsman’ with ‘christian’ and ‘puts sugar on his porridge’ with ‘awakened to the beauty of christ’ and you’ll see how your argument fails.
Who are you to say what I believe/d and whether or not I believed in jesus? I set out to find rational arguments to oppose those who said they were atheists because they saw no reason to believe in god. I tried very hard and exhausted all lines of investigation to show how those people had failed to see something about god and jesus. To my disappointment, I found they were right…
I could just as easily switch the argument on you:
Me: “No one who has examined the evidence rationally will conclude there is a reason to believe god exists.”
You: “I have examined the evidence rationally and I think god exists.”
Me: “Yes, but no one who has TRULY examined the evidence rationally will conclude there is a reason to believe god exists.”
But that would be just as lame an fallacious as your argument, so I won’t.
Wait, I meant to say replace ‘puts sugar on his porridge’ with ‘denies christ’ not ‘awakened to the beauty of christ’
I have no authority or merit to claim that you did or did not believe in Jesus, Jason. All I can do is present what Scripture says about those who say the same thing as you:
“They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us. But they went out, that it might become plain that they all are not of us.” -1 Jn. 2:19
“For everyone who has been born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.” -1 Jn. 5:4
And Jesus says, “And you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.” -Mk. 13:13
So Jason, Scripture seems to characterize a genuine faith as one that endures to the end. If you currently have no reliance on the work that Jesus did on the Cross, then the Bible seems to say you never really did. I don’t say that in a self-superior way. I am no better than you. In fact, if it was based on merit or morality, there is a good chance you’d be in heaven before me.
Please reconsider and place a self-denying trust in His substitutionary sacrifice.
I’m curious what the motivation for christians is to use the old well you mustn’t have REALLY believed then on ex-christians. One reason could be for a sense of superiority. I think another could be to bolster their own faith. Think about it, if someone who believed could one day reject that belief, then they themselves could be vulnerable. Ah, but if that someone never REALLY believed, then that’s different, isn’t it? They can then convince themselves that they’re invulnerable to disbelief.
Either way, such a remark is disparaging, an insult hurled for selfish gain. Claiming justification for such an action by citing a book of dubious authorship makes the insult no less an insult, it merely washes the guilt from the conscience of whoever makes the insult.
Have a nice day.
Well, I think you’ve satisfied your own curiosities it seems. Thanks for stopping by.
I find it very unfair that you would choose to blog about this and then claim that you are merely reporting scripture. Surely you’d only do that if you personally hold the same opinion. That means that you view your faith as better than the faith I had? Your god is a strange, vain God if he insists on faith lasting a lifetime, maybe he’s just desperate for validation?
1 John 2:19 speaks of people such as yourself Ian. I invite you to place a sincere/enduring faith in Christ.